# Investigating Flock: America's Mass Surveillance Company
#  — https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3MQLlMbS-Y

Folks, I'm currently being stopped by
police for doing a story on mass
surveillance and a company that are
putting cameras in your neighborhood,
Flock Safety. Let's see where this thing
goes.
Crime. It's a complex problem that
requires so many people to work together
to solve. And at Flock, it's our mission
to eliminate it.
A former Milwaukee police officer pled
guilty to using the Flock camera system.
Police say he used it to track a
romantic partner and friend.
Hey there, we got an interview here.
For Flock?
Mhm.
Like I think it's just people wanting to
make a lot of money.
Who are you tracking right now?
That's a new one. We're surveilling
Flock right now.
Sir, you're under surveillance.
What are you doing running around in the
street?
None of your business, except for I'm
surveilling you right now. Are you with
Flock?
No, there's a construction firm I work
with, CSD.
99% match.
They're planning to allow them gain
access to the site, and we don't want
them on site. And I don't know if
they're on site.
Hello folks, I'm boots-on-the-ground
journalist Tommy G, and this is a Flock
camera. And you may have noticed cameras
like this popping up around your city.
Hi, I'm Ben Jordan, a researcher and
journalist. As of today, Flock Safety
has installed over 100,000 cameras all
over America. So, chances are that Flock
is in your city, even if you don't know
it. And today, we are teaming up to
investigate Flock Safety.
That's right. Today, we're going to spy
on Flock employees to see how they like
being under surveillance.
If you go to Google or Flock's own
website, the address of their corporate
headquarters will lead you to an empty
building. The actual address is kept
private.
And today, we even reveal their secret
drone operation, and we get boxed in by
police.
We're going to cover the biggest red
flags to be aware of when it comes to
Flock, and arm you with the information
you need to know about the surveillance
takeover coming to a city near you.
In this episode, we'll cover the
arguments for Flock.
And also, the many arguments against
Flock.
Folks, we're here in Atlanta, Georgia on
a surveillance mission. We are headed to
Flock Safety, the headquarters. You
probably have seen cameras from Flock in
your city. And how are they getting
there? Well, from city council approval.
And I want to know what the will of the
people is. Do they want Flock in their
city? Because I do agree this is a
complex issue with good points on either
side. What is the slippery slope of what
we're willing to allow under the selling
point of safety, which is of course how
they always make things more tight and
tyrannical. So, we're going to
infiltrate, find our way in. I'll see
you guys on the ground. So, what we're
finding here is it it appears to be a
nondescript building. It's something
that's kind of funny. We surveil people,
but we also want our own privacy. Kind
of a contradiction in my book, but so
we're going to throw a drone up, do our
own little reconnaissance, and then
we'll move in on the target and get some
license plates. We started off with a
simple mission, surveil Flock employees
to understand this company's attitude
towards being watched. We were also
going to film Flock employee license
plates so I could bring this footage to
Ben, run it through an algorithm, and
understand how invasive this data
gathering can be. But what we found is
this multi-billion dollar company was
not so easy to find. Miguel had a good
point, which was like if your son got
kidnapped, like wouldn't you want Flock
cameras around so that you could track
that car very quickly? And the answer is
yes. Where a lot of people get nervous
is when you see places like China with a
social credit score, and you know they
want to bring that to America. It's the
scope creep of where safety and security
lead to. So, there's just a lot of
implications of once you allow these
cameras cuz on surface level is like,
yeah, put the Flock cameras where all
the shooters are, and let's clean up our
cities. But, where do you draw the line?
And you know that the people in power
never want that line to be in our favor.
To cover how Flock cameras have the
potential to be abused, I have to look
no further than my city of Milwaukee,
where police officer Jose Ayala
obsessively used Flock 180 times over a
2-month span to stalk his ex-girlfriend.
And in McHenry County, Illinois, where I
grew up, this same story played out
where a police chief used Flock to creep
on three separate exes and was later
charged with multiple felonies. And
there are countless stories like this.
For example, earlier this year in
Florida, a sheriff who was working a
side security job for a film set started
hitting on an actress and repeatedly
approached her even after she told him
that she had a boyfriend. Other extras
on the set noticed this and intervened,
so he used the police database to find
her vehicle's information and added it
to the hot list so he would be notified
every single time that she passed a
Flock camera. He then followed her for
miles and then pulled her over telling
her that he had hoped her boyfriend was
with her so he could give him a hard
time. He then allegedly used the police
department's investigative tools to find
her on Instagram and continue stalking
her there.
Folks, this makes me think of the famous
Kanye West line.
And let's be real, this is not a police
problem. To me, this is just people not
being able to handle this level of power
problem.
It's easy to say all cops are bastards
when you hear stories like this, but
let's be honest, could you be trusted
with this power? Think of a time in your
life when you maybe thought that you
were being cheated on by your partner.
Do you think you'd be strong enough to
resist being able to confirm if it were
true? There's a very good reason that
the Fourth Amendment exists and there's
a reason that up until these cameras
started popping up everywhere, a cop
needed to explain to an elected judge
why they needed a warrant to give them
the power to track someone.
So, it appears no company logo on their
building?
No.
No branding?
No branding.
It seems like they're trying to be
relatively incognito and private, which
I also enjoy that. We were initially
trying to just get their employees
license plates on camera. I was almost
picturing a corporate headquarters
you're driving, big parking lot, but
because it's going to be a mixture, I
guess we just have to surveil everyone
for safety, which is I mean, it's just
for safety, guys. We put in Flock
interview requests and
we'd love to talk to their people,
Garrett.
We want to talk to you. We think you
have some good points and we want to
hear how you navigate some of these
privacy concerns. We've already seen
some examples of this technology going
wrong. There's cases of wrongful police
encounters and arrests.
The first thing you'll see when you go
to Flock's website is the words clear
evidence and safer communities. But
let's talk about times where the
evidence wasn't clear and it didn't make
people safe. Look no further than
California where a man spent almost a
month in jail after he was mistakenly
tied to a carjacking even though he was
5 mi away. Or this man in the Carolinas
who was held at gunpoint after an
incorrect Flock hit falsely labeled his
car stolen. Or this woman who had her
own house police harassed and accused of
being a thief even though she was
innocent. And the list goes on.
Folks, this is something you're going to
pay for on both sides. You'll pay on the
front end when your city council votes
against your wishes to install these
cameras all over your city. And you'll
pay for it on the back end when officers
are using clear evidence to brutalize
somebody and you the taxpayer for some
reason has to pay a multi-million dollar
lawsuit, not the police.
And so it seems to me this is a very
expensive problem that almost none of us
want.
It's not like we get together and vote
and say we want this. We own this
decision. We feel good about it. It's a
few members of city council that approve
it and put it in just like the data
centers. And it's like we'll see what
the numbers are. I I just put out a poll
on the on my YouTube
page. Let's see what the the poll is. So
just 27 minutes in, we have 1,100 votes,
94% no.
And don't forget vice presidents of such
companies were caught logging into the
live feeds of girls preschools and
gymnastics classes for hours. Hmm, we'll
have to look into that.
Flock's website claims that nobody from
Flock Safety is accessing or monitoring
your footage. However, through open
records requests I found out that they
looked at our cameras over a thousand
times.
This is Jason, a concerned dad and
whistleblower out of Dunwoody, Georgia
who exposed a story about an alleged
Flock sales demo that apparently
involved Flock employees and police
monitoring children playing within a
Jewish community center.
This includes a Flock vice president
looking at a private third-party
security camera in the little girl's
gymnastics room at my son's daycare.
Flock claims that this was for a sales
demo agreement that my city says doesn't
exist and the people who did those
camera viewings are now deleted
permanently from the Flock system with
no record of it happening.
Hey, you get back here.
Benny boy.
Folks, that's right. People could be
watching your kids play and you as a
taxpayer have to foot a ridiculous bill
to know. Shouldn't that be the most
transparent thing ever, especially if we
are paying for it?
Flock's argument to that is, "Oh, they
were showing off the cameras as a
demonstration for another client." It's
like if I owned a company and I wanted
to hire a surveillance camera company to
install cameras around and they said,
"All right, check this out." And they
open up their laptop and then they log
into a few children in a gymnastics
center. Like I would either shoot them
or call the police. I'm not sure what I
would do, but I would have a very, very
visceral reaction to it because it's
dumb.
They don't even list it in the offices.
Not listed in the specialty. Okay, so
let's just try and see if we can get in
and find our way in.
Mark, how are you?
I'm good.
Good. I'm looking for some help. I'm
trying to find the Flock safety office
for an interview.
They moved
Oh, in Flock safety?
They moved out.
They moved out?
Okay.
Wait, I'll show you their space. Who
thought I was still in there?
Okay. How long ago did they move?
They still own this space.
Okay.
They just moved to Buckhead.
Suite 106.
Okay. So, it's totally empty right now.
Yeah, there's no people in there.
But, the security guard can direct you.
I mean, if you have an interview with
someone, I'm sure
Okay.
he's aware of it.
Okay. They take security very seriously.
Let me call Ben Jordan.
Hello.
Hey, so we're downtown and apparently
they just moved out of their location
and they're heading to a they're moving
their office to a place in Buckhead.
Ooh, okay, interesting.
Do you know how to track down that
address?
Uh, no, that's the first I'm hearing of
it. I mean, I'll I'll do some searching
around, but I I assume you're doing the
same. Um, yeah, I assume there would be
like a news story about it or something
just because it's a pretty big
So, it must have [clears throat] just
happened.
Let's see cuz they're they have their
empty shell of office and uh property
management is helping us out a little
bit, so we're going to say that we have
an interview here. Oh, let's uh see what
they say.
Hey, how you doing?
Hey there, we got an interview here. I
know they just moved.
Um
For what?
Mhm.
Who you have an interview with?
We're the news.
Well, no, I was saying who you have an
interview with.
Garrett, ideally, but if there's another
representative.
You said Garrett? Garrett, is the CEO?
Mhm, mhm.
He's from Atlanta.
Yeah, we're we're trying to get an
interview today, yeah.
Oh, no, you
Yeah, but there's nobody here.
Yeah, or
Damn, so they sent us to the wrong spot.
How long ago did they move?
Uh
It's probably like 2 weeks ago.
Yeah, but we don't have anything, so
we'll see you guys, okay?
So, did y'all did y'all talk to anybody
to come here today or y'all just came on
We just came impromptu, just like the
cameras are springing up impromptu
around the country, so we just wanted to
ask about that.
Oh, okay, yeah, nobody's here.
Okay, where's the spot in Buckhead?
We can't give that out.
Why is that? Like for security reasons?
Oh, so they care about their security a
lot, like their own privacy?
Can I go?
Thank you.
Can we put a camera by your house in
your house? What wait, you guys care
about security here?
Yeah, we also care about our privacy,
too, so well we'll see you guys at the
next location, okay?
That's the security guard right there.
That's the same guy?
Yeah, that's the security guard, 100%.
Hey sir, we're surveilling you, is that
okay?
Do you consent to being surveilled?
We're just filming you right now. Do you
consent to us surveilling you with our
cameras?
Oh, well, we're doing it for safety.
Oh, no, he's getting our license plate.
What are we going to do?
Sir,
we're not having that. You filmed us,
we're filming you double now.
Oh, yeah.
Get him. Film him. Surveil him. Sir,
does getting surveilled make you feel
uncomfortable at all? Can you send my
regards to Garrett, please? Sir, are you
calling the cops?
Yeah.
He's calling the cops on us.
I don't feel safe, either. We should
call our cops, too. Sir, do you feel in
danger right now? Why are you calling
the cops? You got to tighten up, man.
So, I I pulled the records of Eat More
Reality Trust bought a building for
essentially did the business of buying
building for block a
35,000 square foot lease at the Medici
at 3284 Northside Parkway.
Okay, we're at perfect. We're 11 minutes
from there.
Are you guys nervous at all?
A little bit. They might know we're
coming, though.
Yeah, they definitely know we're coming.
Let's scope it. Is this actually
mixed-use residential?
Yeah, this These are all residential
right here.
Okay, so what do we got here?
It looks like they've got mostly privacy
windows.
If you want to make your voice heard,
you can visit people in person. And
obviously, we advise you do that
peacefully, respectfully, politely. We
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and now let's get to the video. After
digging into real estate records, we
found that Flock appears to have
secretly relocated their headquarters to
this building right here.
We, the people, our voices have just not
been heard, it feels like. This pressure
adds up, and we need to use it. Again,
we are the ants, and the ants can win
against the grasshoppers if we team up
properly. They've been here for about 3
weeks now, and I don't see
Flock anywhere. It seems they're looking
for some privacy.
Good morning.
How are you?
What's going on?
Oh, we're just here for a meeting. We're
going up to Beautiful building.
So, you got to have an FYI real quick.
You want to be taking photos of
something in the building?
Where is that
For an interview at at the Flock
headquarters.
I'm sorry, I'm going to stop you right
there.
Okay, that's okay.
No, you can't. No, sir. Sir.
What?
The floors are locked down here. And
sir, is that rolling right now? You need
to cut that off.
Film?
that out of my face, please?
We're just going up for an interview to
the Flock building.
No, sir.
You can't do anything like that. You
don't have a point of contact or
anything like that. No, sir.
You're telling me the Flock people told
you to say no? Cuz they They didn't say
no to us.
That camera is
is catching me. Would you mind turning
it off? I'm going to ask you to go,
please.
Can you please leave?
We have something.
Can you please leave the building?
Seems like privacy is a top priority
here, huh?
please leave the building? Thank you.
Appreciate you.
Well, Flock's new office is here in this
building. Uh they don't want people to
know that. And obviously they have their
guys at the front keeping us out. He's
doing his job. I get it. So far on
Instagram,
8,000 votes.
91% no from 1 hour ago.
So far on YouTube,
1 hour ago, 3,500 votes, 93% no.
I wouldn't even want Flock cameras
installed in my arch nemesis
neighborhood. What's bad for America is
bad for Americans, period.
Folks, I love this country, but let's be
real. Who here watching actually trust
the federal government? Not me. A good
case study we can look at is in
Minneapolis where ICE agents use Flock
competitor Vigilant Solutions for the
stated mission of tracking illegal
immigrants. Over the course of their
operation, ICE agents disregarded the
rights of citizens so many times that
even the Twin Cities police chief
acknowledged that ICE personally
violated the rights of hundreds of his
citizens and even some of his own
off-duty officers.
Recently, in the last 2 weeks, we as law
enforcement community have been
receiving endless complaints about civil
rights violations.
And folks, I know this firsthand. I have
a family member in Minneapolis that got
boxed in while trying to make a deposit
at the bank for the suspected crime of
looking a little tan. And I personally
talked to two Target employees who are
American citizens that got pulled off
the job, beaten, detained, and kicked
out of an ICE vehicle.
I'm literally a US citizen.
State Representative Michael Howard says
he's spoken to them and they've both
since been released.
No, I'm not okay.
And folks, the point is this. This is
not a debate about whether you agree
with ICE using aggressive methods to
round up illegal immigrants. The bigger
picture is knowing that the federal
government is able to use any excuse
they want hiding under the guise of
public safety to fiercely crack down on
whomever they choose. Today, the target
is illegal immigrants. Tomorrow, the
target could be you.
The next guy we're going to meet is Ben
Jordan. I think he has done the best
journalistic work on Flock cameras. Uh
very interesting guy. Excited for you to
meet him.
Cool spot, huh?
I'm Ben Jordan. I've been a musician my
whole life. I'm a researcher. I have a
YouTube channel that usually does
science education, some journalism.
Recently, the surveillance and privacy
stuff has kind of blown up and I've
weirdly been at the center of it, so.
What do you make of Flock Safety?
I view it a little bit less nefariously
than some people do. Like, I think it's
just people wanting to make a lot of
money. It's Marc Andreessen who
uh is I mean, he's the person who has
invested the most money in Flock Safety.
Marc Andreessen, whose venture capital
firm Andreessen Horowitz is Flock's
biggest institutional investor, was just
appointed by the Pentagon to their
Defense Policy Board. So, for the people
wondering about Flock's proximity to
federal power, their eyebrows can only
raise after news like this.
Marc Andreessen has been involved in the
Cambridge Analytica scandal. He's been
fined. I mean, like he has this long
laundry list of privacy violations and
making money off of people's data. And
then I see the rest of it just like your
standard move fast and break things tech
company. They're just trying to grow as
fast as they can so they could reach an
IPO. When it comes to like security
vulnerabilities, when it comes to legal
vulnerabilities, I believe that they're
just trying to kick that can down the
road until they launch an IPO and then
it could be uh deducted from people's
401K when they have to pay the fines on
it or when they have to uh take down
100,000 cameras because of security
vulnerabilities.
Would you argue that Flock cameras do
make cities safer?
No. Uh
but I also wouldn't argue that they
don't. My only argument that they
wouldn't make cities safer is because
[music] you're taking money from things
like community policing and putting them
into a third-party tech company, and
paying $200,000 for a drone that costs
$15,000. [music]
To understand how law enforcement
actually views Flock, we spoke to three
different perspectives: an Indiana
police chief, a Wisconsin sheriff, and a
veteran officer in Georgia.
Currently, we have 850 cameras in our
city. And what it's utilized for is to
monitor business districts, residential
areas, um hotspots, and our city parks.
To have 850 cameras running in this town
of 26,000, what is the annual budget to
keep that going?
Well, they last pretty long, don't get
me wrong. But when it's time to replace
them, [music] is when it gets expensive.
Right now, my budget for technology as a
whole, I probably spend just close to
$600,000 a year. That would be the
equivalent of six officer salaries. But
the job [music] that it's doing is doing
the job of probably 15-20 officers.
Could you say without a doubt this
technology makes your city safer?
Without a doubt, it makes it safer. I I
would I wouldn't know what to do without
it.
So, working with Flock, what was your
experience like with them?
Our experience working with Flock has
been fantastic. We used them to
really help and provide us a lot of
coverage in the rural parts of Dane
County. We are responsible for about
1,000 square miles of patrol [music]
area, including 41 square miles of
waterways here in Dane County out of the
1,200. So, the use of the technology was
fantastic because it allowed us to be in
places that we couldn't be. So, overall,
they helped us solve numerous crimes,
including homicides. Um also, they
helped us find individuals that were
missing. So, it played a significant
role in allowing us to keep and maintain
the peace in the rural parts of our
community, which is typically very
different than in the urban parts of of
of a county. It did not gather any sort
of driver information, race, gender,
or anything to that extent.
Like, let's say if you have a missing
person, and they're like an elderly
person with dementia, and they're in
danger of dying because they're
dehydrated, and they're driving around
not knowing that they're [ __ ]
dehydrated. Then it can help with stuff
like that.
Or if someone kid- kidnaps a child.
So, what are we looking at here?
Uh this is just one of the Flock
cameras.
Can I ask you how you got your hands on
that, or is that classified?
eBay.
eBay?
Yep.
Okay. And tell me what goes through your
mind when you look at this piece of
technology.
Um I get kind of frustrated because
they're very expensive, and it costs tax
money, and just the fact that it's
tracking everyone everywhere you go,
regardless of if you're on a list of um
like wanted people.
So, you have to be in a funnel for most
license plate readers, but for Flock,
it's everyone.
Yes, and it's nationally shared across
like pretty much every police
department.
And another thing to add on to what he
was saying is there's something called
Flock Nova, which uses something called
OSINT, or open source intelligence,
which is your Strava bike rides, your
searches that that are public, your
Google, all of your data that's online
gets combined with your police record,
and with your social security number,
and with your address, and all that
stuff. And then with your location
everywhere you you you've been. As you
go from like license plate detection to
porn site search super fast. To me, it's
clearly a Fourth Amendment violation.
I noticed that Flock was actually pretty
big on privacy. Do you think that's a
bit of a hypocritical stance?
Yeah, of course.
When initially looking into the company,
it just randomly I I noticed that the
CEO bought his house through a trust, so
he could hide his address from the
public. The new office address that I
got that I found for you, it's not
listed publicly online. And like when
you told me that, I just knew to look
for realty trust. So, I was like, "Oh,
okay. A realty They probably got this
through a realty trust, so they could
make sure that nobody knows where their
office is." You have this $7 billion
company, and and you don't want people
to know where your office is located.
Like you're that private. Like I don't
have the option to leave my driveway and
go to Chick-fil-A without them knowing
where I am, but I can't know where their
office is.
You have some cities where crime has
increased after Flock came around and
you have some cities where it's
decreased. Um there's not been
an actual
good peer-reviewed study on if license
plate readers are effective or not
nationwide.
How accurate are these license plate
trackers?
They're pretty accurate.
What do you say to the citizens that say
I don't want this in my city. I It's an
invasion of privacy. I don't like this.
We're not here to watch you. You do have
an expectation of privacy inside your
residence, but this is no different than
people with ring cameras and cell
phones. Once you step outside your
house, that expectation of privacy is
gone.
They sort of act like they weren't able
to catch criminals before that. Like
they didn't have like they weren't able
to call another police department and
say, "Hey, we have a red sedan
being driven by somebody who looks like
this with this license plate number.
Watch out for it." And then be able to
find it. Or as if traffic cameras hadn't
existed before Flock Safety. Or as if
ALPRs haven't existed before Flock
Safety. I often want to tell police
like, "Give yourself a little more
credit." Like don't let this
multi-billion-dollar company take credit
for your hard work. Like you're the one
solving the crime. I could push a button
on some of these cameras and log into it
and delete and change and modify data.
They can't be used in court because of
that because nobody can prove that
they're secure. I hate surveillance
cameras. I don't like I just don't like
them in general and I have them all over
this property because the cops have
showed up here and because we have
private investigators. And it sucks that
I have to invest in this stuff that I
hate so I can at least have my own side
of the story in case a cop comes here
and says that I assaulted them or
something.
Probably because the CEO of this company
is telling people that I'm a violent
lawless activist.
And then unfortunately, there's
terroristic organizations like D-Flock
whose primary motivation is chaos. They
are closer to Antifa than they are
anything else. And that I think is
unfortunate because we don't want chaos
or I don't want chaos. I like law and
order.
And so it's like the the whole thing is
just a huge infringement on people's
rights.
I mean, when I first got my hands on one
of these, I was amazed by how shitty
they were. It saves data every time it
detects motion, and then it has both a
Wi-Fi and an LTE radio inside, and then
it uploads
images and data from that [music] from
what it detects. This costs $3,500 a
year.
Each camera that's up is $3,500?
$3,500 for this. Yeah, I mean, this is
the cheapest one. This is this is the
cheapest one you could have. Yeah, so if
you have like 10 in your city, that's
$35,000
a year.
I'm Isaac. I'm just a student, and my
school pretty much picked up, I think,
48 of these over the course of the last
2 years. But, I noticed on campus there
were a bunch of these little devices
with a Flock logo. It turned out that
they were microphones. I looked into
them, and I found a like press release
from Flock where they explicitly stated
that they were only gunshot detectors,
and they would delete anything outside
of a gunshot. Um, I think about 2 months
after I started looking into it, though,
they sent a software update over the
air. So, now all of these microphones
that are spread all over my college
campus, they are just actively listening
for voices now, which
is very uncomfortable, and I'm not
particularly happy about that.
This is a multi-use parking lot, but
there's a high probability that some of
these people are Flock employees. We saw
people going across the bridge to the
office. So, we're going to surveil the
entire parking lot and run it through a
license plate reader technology and see
if there's any people we should keep an
eye on.
[music]
Andrew, what can we use these license
plates? Like, can we track people? Can
we know where they live?
So, there's this
uh
ParkMobile, if you're familiar with it,
if you've ever used it. ParkMobile had
like a massive data breach, and all the
license plates were pinned to
everybody's like credit card
information. And so, you could actually
just like take this data, which
from this program I made you could just
like download a CSV if you wanted to.
You could take this data and then run it
past the ParkMobile data breach and see
who all these people are, where they
live, what their credit card number is.
It feels pretty invasive.
Generally, the reason I even make this
stuff is to show people what a black hat
hacker can do.
So the viewer understands, we're going
to go about 2-mile loop from your house.
Yeah, we'll go like maybe 3 miles total.
I mean, this one clearly you can just
walk up to it and press the button
if you wanted to. The laws that require
that mailbox to be put in concrete or
like uh that stop sign to have so much
it has to go down in the ground so much
and there's usually concrete or gravel
under there. And this thing they just
plop into the ground without paying any
attention to the uh roadside safety.
Okay, so this is the first one close to
your house. And now our journey
continues.
So we have one there.
One there.
After seeing over a dozen cameras within
a short distance from Ben's house, it
became clear he couldn't [music] even go
get gas or take a [ __ ] without being
surveilled. After realizing this
uncomfortable reality, we next went
[music] to uncover Flock's secret drone
facility where we soon discovered
something strange.
Yeah, I guess this is the drone
facility.
Again, no company logo. This looks like
an Amazon distribution center.
Yeah, okay. Yeah, I'm pretty sure this
isn't a construction company that we're
at. I'm pretty pretty sure this is a
[ __ ]
This is all like shadow names or
Yeah. O S equipment. I mean, as far as I
know, we're on public property right
now, so
This is the most heavily guarded
construction company.
that's a new one. That must be a
prototype.
We're surveilling Flock right now.
How's it going, man?
Good. You guys
Oh, we We just brought our own Flock
camera to the situation. Are you a Flock
guy?
I'm not.
Okay. Wow, you got some cool cameras
over here, too.
Oh, it's okay. I'm just going to get
your license plate, if that's all right.
I'm You're under surveillance, sir.
Sir.
Sir, you're under surveillance.
You You okay?
Oh, yeah. We're just uh surveilling the
scene.
For what?
Just for safety reasons.
what are you doing running around in the
street?
None None of your business, except for
I'm surveilling you right now.
It's not very safe to run There's a lot
of trucks that come up and down here. We
had a truck come down today, and he was
going quite fast. So, just
This is a dead spot, as you can see. So,
just
Thank you. Are you with Flock?
What?
Are you with Flock?
No, there's a construction firm I work
with, TSB.
Are you doing the back maneuver?
He's got all the Flock cameras on his
front set up.
Oh, what the
This man, James Boyce, is a former
British Army veteran and a current Flock
supply chain manager. Not only did he
lie about working for Flock, which I'm
guessing is probably normal at this
company, but he also implied to Georgia
law enforcement that I could have been
armed. And we'll soon see if that puts
my life in danger. They're a very
secretive company for a company that
doesn't want your secrecy to be
preserved. Nondescript building.
No signage. We'll track some of these
license plates to make sure there's
nothing nefarious happening around here.
And if they're against that, then
they're a left-wing activist. I'm trying
to talk to Flock.
You guys got to go. This is private
property. You're not allowed here. I'm
sorry. Is that If that's one of ours,
we'll take it back.
No, no, no. This is We got it from eBay.
Oh, okay. Well,
We're trying to talk to Flock, guys.
I can't help you there.
Okay, well, you're under surveillance
right now. I just hope you know. It's
for safety reasons. You're being
watched.
It's kind of nuts, isn't it? Have a good
day, sir. Sir, it appears this entire
building is under kind of a front
company within Flock. And I would guess
a lot of their company is structured
like that. It's umbrella companies,
LLCs, C corps that own this, that are
connected to that. And
it's clever arrangement, and they're
well within their right to do that. But
again,
it speaks to the hypocrisy of the whole
story of they want to be private. It
appears this entire company is under
their construction organization. They
have some umbrellas going on, some LLCs,
some maneuvering
Yeah.
in the corporate structure.
You don't want to be like
open with the public. You want privacy.
Cuz the truth should not be afraid to
speak. Anytime there's an element of
hiding, it makes you wonder why.
And
it's a classic example of
do as I say, not as I do.
Yeah. So, there is like a good argument
to this. Like, if you get a job at at
Flock Safety for whatever reason, like,
there's a pretty big chance that you got
that job because you worked for a police
department or because you worked for a
city council, and now, you know, you may
have some conflict of interest in taking
this job. Nobody takes this job without
knowing what the company does, without
knowing how controversial it is.
Bloody hell, James called the cops on
us, and here's what he said.
Uh
good morning, Mom. I'm uh
Okay. And what's going on there, sir?
Uh yeah, I sorry for calling. We've had
some incidents here today. I work for a
company called Flock Safety, which is
This is our main distribution center.
And we've had a string of, like, YouTube
and streamers or stalkers or whatever
you want to call it. They've gone
through our headquarter office and other
facilities.
And now they've turned up here.
They're They're trying to either gain
access to the site, and we don't want
them on site.
Uh and they've been driving around the
perimeter, basically asking everyone who
works here, and I don't know if they're
armed or not.
Okay. We're on our way to you, okay?
Okay.
Okay, thank you.
We got police.
Oh.
Cops are here.
Oh, are they blocking us all in now?
Is that a security guy?
I don't know.
Hey, you guys move up so he can get out,
okay? Sorry, man. We're getting in a
little predicament here. Uh we're the
guys to talk to.
Are all y'all in this car, too?
He He's He's trying to get out of here
right now.
have anything to do
No. Have you guys heard of Flock, the
Flock Safety Company?
Yeah, yeah, of course.
They're the ones that have the cameras
everywhere in your Okay, so this is
their undercover headquarters right here
with their drones. Um, and we did
surveillance on them, so we filmed them
and said, "How do you guys like it?" And
now they have the cops here. What do you
guys think about Flock cameras in your
city?
Honestly, I don't appreciate those. I'm
not going to lie. I don't appreciate the
drones coming into my neighborhood. But,
it's just not a good feeling, honestly,
to see those those drones flying around
everywhere.
It's like it's kind of weird to me. I
don't know.
Let me tell you this cuz so you you guys
are working hard in a home improvement
company. Your tax dollars go to your
local city where they spend money on
cameras whether you like it or not. And
you're literally paying for the cameras
that are watching you as you drive
around town.
Yeah, and we have we have no like we
have no say-so when it comes to that,
either, you know? They just do that on
their own. So, I feel like it's kind of
[ __ ] up, you know?
Any updates so far to what's going on
here?
Yeah, Uber Eats is here.
I mean, can we at least let the people
go in and out? Like this is the thing
with public safety that's The police, in
order to make things safe, they're
blocking off the entire roadway, so we
can't get out as if we look like a
flight risk. And now it's putting the
public at risk where she has to stop her
car over here.
Yeah, I mean, nobody's done anything
wrong here. Like you're literally doing
journalism. Uh, everybody here just
literally came like they essentially
just came with to give me a ride back.
Like it's it's ridiculous. Like we're
not on their property.
Sir, he's got to go.
We all have things to do today.
He's blockading us.
Okay, okay. Now now it's something else
cuz I ain't got [ __ ] to do with this,
but now I'm trying to leave.
I'm I got out the car because you're
blocking
Sir, you don't got to disrespect me
right now.
Sir, are we free to leave?
No, I'm I can't leave. I'm
Sir, are we being detained?
Is this the only exit?
Yes.
I wanted to see if this absolute
numbskull of an officer from Smyrna
Police Department violated my rights.
So, I ran the scenario by my friend
Officer Toombs from the Clayton County
Sheriff's Office.
You can tell us to go fly a kite and
walk right off.
And if I ask you, "Hey, am I being
detained?" Do you have to give me a yes
or no answer?
Absolutely.
You guys have done nothing wrong.
Actually, we've also done nothing wrong
and yet we're blockaded by a police
officer. Are we being detained?
The manager wants to speak
It's a yes or no question, sir.
You're going to wait here until the
manager talks to
You're holding me until that guy talks,
but you're not telling me if I'm going
to be detained.
Yeah, you are.
Am I allowed to leave?
Can I go in my car and leave?
They are with Flock Safety, they just
confirmed.
Hey.
What's up, brother?
Hi, how are you doing, sir?
Good.
So,
tell him what you need to tell him.
So, gentlemen, I I just want to be very
clear. Um there's a multi-tenant
site here with a lot of people that are
just trying to work. I've got yourself
and all the other one running in the
street. I had to put my brakes on just
to stop to make sure you're okay.
Are you safe right now, sir?
Uh
well, I don't know that, do I? So, I
just want to make sure we've had reports
that you've been to basically every
Flock Safety site and facility that we
know of.
Correct.
Yeah, so
Your surveillance is correct. We're
doing our own surveillance.
See, people don't really feel safe right
now with people randomly trying to get
into our sites and buildings.
Oh, wait. You don't feel safe being
surveilled. Is that what you're saying?
Not at all, sir.
Cuz that's what you guys do to us
without our consent.
Okay.
And I think it's interesting when you
guys have this happen, you call the
police and make us get stopped, but then
you do it and it's okay?
No, we don't have the devices What we'd
like you to do is basically we're saying
that you're trespassing on this site and
we'd like you to leave peacefully.
This guy's blocking us that you called.
Physically leave.
All of us?
This is my office that I work at in
Midtown Home and Flu.
Are you going to let us leave?
Can I not physically leave my in place
of employment?
I'm speaking because I have something to
say, sir, and you are blocking me.
Um what we're asking is like you're
essentially trespassing on this site at
the moment. There's a lot of people that
don't know your intent. I don't know if
you're armed.
I don't know if you're armed.
Okay, that's fine. But
I mean, it's the same playing field,
bud.
I mean, that essentially doesn't really
bother us anymore today. And
Was it bothering you to film you guys?
I'm not bothered by filming. I'm being
bothered by trying to go on a lunch
break and people are running around in
the street.
Was it such a um disservice to your day
that you felt the need to call the
police for it?
I think if you have someone hanging
around outside your house, you'd
probably do the same thing.
Uh this is a business that happens to
have cameras around the nation. And some
people don't like it and we want to do
our due diligence. By the way, we have
put in a request to your press team to
actually speak to you face-to-face and
have a fair interview. And uh we haven't
gotten back from that. So, we did our
own digging ourselves.
Guys, these are channels. I'm
pretty sure Flock will obviously talk to
you about what they need to uh and
hopefully clear up anything they do.
After Flock called the police and had us
detained, I immediately filed a public
records request for the police reports
and body cam footage. In Georgia, by
law, a city or police department has 3
days to respond to a FOIA request. I
didn't even get an acknowledgement
response for 10 days. I then followed
their instructions confirming the
request on their own portal and a week
later they rejected it claiming that it
[music] was cancelled due to no
response. So, I want the citizens of
Smyrna, Georgia to understand that if
this nonsense continues, then their
property taxes will be paying my legal
fees and any fines when I sue the city
for the records that they're obligated
by law to provide me.
Folks, it was important to me to try and
get Flock involved in this story. Ben
tried reaching out to them about their
security flaws. I tried reaching out to
their PR team and here's how that
conversation went.
you were there last week, what was your
goal to try to talk to someone at Flock
or just to get the aerial footage or
what was the goal?
Just before we go any further, I guess
is there any uh potential in doing um an
interview with Garrett or walking one of
the headquarters whether it's the drone
facility?
Well, I want to assess out where you're
coming from with this. My question for
you is if this is like a let me get
Garrett in a weird position and ask him
a bunch of Ben Jordan ask questions. I'm
not sure that that's a really good use
of his time. So, I just am curious, are
you coming at it through like a fair
lens or are you coming through it Are
you Are you Are you coming at this from
like a sensationalist YouTuber lens?
I think what people are afraid of is the
potential for a mass surveillance state.
Once it's in place and the scope keeps
creeping or a national emergency comes
in,
then all of a sudden the rules change
and something that's we were told came
into our communities for one reason is
now used for a much more draconian
reason and I think that's the other
thing that people would be afraid of.
Logistically, how would this work?
Garrett is in Atlanta most of the time.
He has like no availability over the
next couple of weeks or months. So, you
can also understand that I'm coming from
a position where I have to protect
Garrett and Flock.
For sure.
And a lot of people requested new
interviews and to look at things and
then the story comes out and it's really
shitty.
I don't love that.
you guys trespassed on Friday and that
Ben was there as well. I just don't love
that. It
like It sends a weird message because
I'm putting faith If I tell you we're
going to work together, I've never
worked with you. I'm not saying that's a
bad thing. I'm just saying like never
worked with you. I'm going to kind of
put my trust in you and I just know
right now that you guys trespassed on
our property.
Yeah.
And it felt invasive.
But Momma, does that prove my point of
it feels invasive? That's what I'm
trying That's the point I'm trying to
make exactly.
I understand. You're saying it feels
invasive that you guys were on our
property, but Flock cameras being on
public roads taking pictures of public
license plates, which is the point of a
license plate, I don't believe that what
what a Flock camera is is invasive. I
got kind of freaked out at the beginning
when you're like, "This is what it's
like to feel your privacy invaded. This
is how people feel about Flock."
And I'm like, "I understand that's how
people feel, but that's not what Flock
is. And so, if you're open to debunking
that with me in a fair way,
Sure.
I I don't want your segment to be like,
Flock wouldn't participate because we
have nothing to hide.
But folks, Flock did hide and they sent
me an email saying they were not going
to participate and it made me ask, do
you guys get the impression that they
are a transparent company and do you
feel comfortable about them putting
cameras in over 6,000 cities around the
country? And folks, for reference,
months ago, Ben Jordan tried to
discreetly tell Flock about security
vulnerabilities he saw to help them fix
it and this is how they responded.
So, to give you a comparison of how
security vulnerability reporting usually
works, when I found a mild encryption
vulnerability in Ring cameras or
vulnerabilities in surveillance robots,
the companies immediately reached out to
me and offered to pay me to help them
document and mitigate the problems. I
know of three separate security
researchers who reached out to Flock
Safety about vulnerabilities and were
immediately given a non-disclosure
agreement. This happened with John
Gaines and the irony is, if they acted
ethically and transparently with John,
then the vulnerabilities probably would
have been fixed before I even started
making the video.
And then this is I guess this is the
ancestral relationship between Flock and
police departments where now all of the
sudden, journalists looking into Flock,
this is their hidden drone headquarters
that we're looking at. We were at their
other hidden locations earlier this
morning. And we're probably on the the
list now, right?
I just need you to leave.
Brother, you call the people that are
blocking us in. Do you see how that's
counterintuitive? Taxpayer funded, by
the way. This is pretty uh this is
pretty great. Alrighty, so we got one
cop, two cop, and then we got the Flock
employee who doesn't like being filmed
himself that called the police for us
filming him. So, uh make it make sense.
I appreciate Ben for joining me. Ben is
a YouTuber that I have watched to learn
and inform myself on this issue. Highly
recommend you check his channel out. The
link is in the description and um keep
learning, keep reading, keep asking
questions. That's our duty as a citizen,
and we'll see you at the next story.
Peace.